Episode released on: 20. March 2023
Harnessing Agility for Customer Experience Success with Lee Houghton (miniseries 3/3) – CX GOALKEEPER – Customer Experience Goals
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The CX Goalkeeper had the great opportunity to interview Lee Houghton
LinkedIn Headline: Empowering Senior Leaders To Improve Their Business Performance And People Engagement!! | Transitioning Change Teams From Just Surviving To Thriving | Host Of Business Problems Solved Podcast!
Highlights:
- 00:00 Game Start
- 00:36 Lee’s introduction
- 01:29 Lee’s Values
- 04:40 Agility
- 09:24 Leveraging Agility
- 16:33 Learning
- 18:01 Downside of Agility
- 23:51 The starting point
- 27:06 Giving the best
- 31:23 The Future
- 34:04 Book Suggestion
- 35:19 Contact Details
- 36:11 Golden Nugget
and much more
Guest’s Contact Details:
- https://www.linkedin.com/in/lhoughton/
- LEE at getknowledge.co.uk
- Follow Lee’s Podcast on all platforms: Business Problems Solved Podcast – Lee Houghton
His book suggestion:
- Switch by Dan Heath
- The Power Of Habit by Charles Duhigg
Guest’s Golden Nuggets:
- The challenge is to become truly agile! There are two metrics: metric number one is the need to increase the number of thoughts in our people, and metric number two is to reduce the time between thoughts, conversation, and action. These are two metrics that we don’t measure in any organization, but if we did, and we were consciously trying as leaders to increase the number of thoughts by asking better questions and reducing the time between thought, conversation, and action, then we would be agile.
Metric number 1: the need to increase the number of thoughts in our people. Metric number 2 is to reduce the time between thoughts, conversation, and action. (…) if we measure them, then we would be agile Lee Houghton on the CX Goalkeeper Podcast
Tweet
#customerexperience #leadership #cxgoalkeeper #cxtransformation #podcast
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What did we discuss?
Gregorio Uglioni
Ladies and gentleman, welcome to the CX goalkeeper podcast your host, Greg will have smart discussions with friends, experts and thought leaders on customer experience transformation and leadership. Please follow this podcast on your preferred platform. I am sure you will enjoy the next episode with the guest I selected for you,
Ladies and gentleman, today It’s really really a big pleasure because Lee Houghton together with me on the CX Goalkeeper podcast. Hi Lee, how are you?
Lee Houghton
I am very well Greg, how are you sir?
Gregorio Uglioni
super happy and super thrilled to start the discussion with you about agility. But before we deep dive in this interesting topic that everybody is speaking about. And I think we need also clarity about that. And we would like to learn more about you. And therefore as usual, I asked my guests to introduce themselves. Could you please do that?
Lee Houghton
Yeah, of course I will. So my name is Lee Houghton, I am co founder of a business called get knowledge and primarily, we champion people in the improvement equation. It’s all about the people. For us. We set up a business about five years ago, primarily coaching. But we do offer some training and consultancy as well. But it’s all about business improvements. But from where the people lens, as opposed to maybe some of the some of the technology that is out there is either a minute we champion people in the improvement equation is probably the easiest way to articulate what we do and how we help.
Gregorio Uglioni
I think that this way connected with what we are doing customer experience professional, focus on on people, people, people, people and trying to improve the experiences of our customers. And therefore super thrilled to to deep dive, perhaps to learn a bit more about you and to get some insights about you. Which value drives you in life?
Lee Houghton
Yeah, this is a this is a great question. And there’s, there’s a few. There’s a few that I have. For the business, we’ve got four values, which are fun, authenticity, trust and caring, and last a spelling the word fact, and, and where they came from, is a place of what’s really important to me and my business partner, because I lost my best man five, nearly five years ago now. And he left him with three lessons. And those three lessons were always be yourself, make good friends, and recognize that time is limited. And so those are the three things that really really drives me now because I’ve spent the last five years understanding what they’re mean to me. And, and they’ve, they’ve manifested themselves in our business values and fun authentic care and interest. But for me, it’s about always been myself. It’s about making good friends and connections and relationships. And it’s about acting now. Because time is limited. So those three things really have have shaped my life over the last five years, when I’ve started to really understand what they’re mean for me, and it’s taken me losing my best man, it’s to really start to understand myself more. So yeah, so those those are, what I’m trying to live and, and do better every day.
Gregorio Uglioni
Thank you very much for sharing your story for the course of sharing the story. And sorry, because I’m really sorry to hear that, that that’s that’s life. And as we know, time is the big question how much time we still we still have on this earth. And we are gifted to be here and trying to do something relevant for us and for older people. But you shared also in the previous question, something interesting that I have something in common with your son, perhaps you can quickly share that.
Lee Houghton
Yeah, absolutely. So So when when I realized that there was an opportunity to speak with you today, and I saw the title of the title of the podcast and I’ve listened to a few episodes and it’s called the CX goalkeeper, my boy is nine years old. And back four years ago, he fell in love with football and he fell in love with the position of goalkeeper so for the last four to five years I’ve been have I’ve got a deeper interest and a really deep interest in goalkeeping through through my boys So here he’s my retirement plan if all goes well, in 10 years time I can retire because he is a Premier League International goalkeeper but yeah, so that’s yeah, that’s that’s why I was really drawn to this podcast as well it’s just because of the affinity I’ve got with it. We’ve We’ve goalkeepers now which are which I never realized that I would have as much for you. It’s just really good.
Gregorio Uglioni
From my deepest that I hope that for you and for your son but this is also something that my sister was hoping to retire without working because I was goalkeeper. But now I am the CX goalkeeper. Let’s say if you are on the podcast and I have more success with this podcast, then then With my former career as a coach, no joke aside, you said also something really interesting a goalkeeper as should also be quite agile. And therefore I’m super keen to kick off this discussion and learn more from your private life and on your business life. What’s your definition of agility?
Lee Houghton
Yeah, so this one we think a goalkeeper as well is that the traditional definition of agility is to move quickly and easily. And we often think that the goalkeeper is the one that is the most agile on the football pitch, because they move quickly and easily. And we’ve got a dive all over the place. But I don’t really think that that’s the most important thing. When we think about agility. I think agility for me is about thinking and moving freely and easily towards a goal. So and I think there’s some subtle differences in the two. So if I think about the traditional agility is by moving quickly, moving quickly, and easily. And that’s just, that’s just movement, but to truly know where we should be moving, then we’ve got we’ve got to think better. So we’ve got to think and move. And we’ve got to move freely, not necessarily quick label freely and easily towards the goal towards a destination. And for me, that is success, we will never, ever achieve true agility, we will never think and move freely and easily towards a goal. Or that’s perfectly acceptable. I think the realization that actually, I would challenging people to think better, I would challenging them to think more I would, I would challenge them to move, I would challenging them to be free, I would challenge them to move easily. And anytime any friction occurs within any of those four words that I’ve just said, towards a particular destination, then it’s an opportunity to get better, an opportunity to learn an opportunity to improve. And I think for me, that’s what agility is about. It’s about, that’s the destination. That’s, that’s what we’re trying to achieve. And we want to do that that sentence that I’ve just said, what it’s about how we navigate that, how we truly understand what is getting in the way of our people’s thinking, and movement. So yes, that, for me is what agility is about. It’s not necessarily about the destination. It’s about how we get there, and the things that prevent us from getting there.
Gregorio Uglioni
And reflecting what you said at the beginning, that the goalkeeper needs to be agile to jump last left, right and so on. But I think important characteristics of goalkeepers is also to be extremely enjoy in their head to understand and reading in advance what will happen because you need to find the right position you need to help your teammates pay attention, this could happen that could happen go on the left, go on the right. And therefore I really love that you brought me to think really about agility of a goalkeeper because what always we preach is a lot of companies say that they are agile, but they are not really agile because they are not agile in their mindset and way of thinking. And now with this example, it’s clearly quite clear, goalkeepers need to be agile, and I always was disc comparison, goalkeeper with a CX professional. And also this is an important characteristic to read in advance what will happen so that you can really prepare prepare very well.
Lee Houghton
Yeah, I love that. That’s that’s the key part, isn’t it? So it’s like, so when I watch my boy training, he’s he’s trying to look at whether the whether the attacker is lifting his thoughts, and then he’s moving to that position of where the ball is. And then he’s reacting to that surely come out, surely stare. And it’s not just about standing on your line. And diving to the left or diving to the right. It’s true. I guess I jailed definition. It’s about the thing before it’s about making those decisions and thinking about the right thing to do. And so yeah, I think there’s a lot of synergy between goalkeeping and agility. I mean, yeah, it’s, yeah, it really, really got really good. And my mind’s got all sorts of different places, just with, with the links between both of them really powerful.
Gregorio Uglioni
Let’s say today, I’m not the CX goalkeeper, but I am the Agile goalkeeper, or we can start a new podcast together about agility and goalkeeping.
Lee Houghton
Let’s do it.
Gregorio Uglioni
Thank you very much. Perhaps also in in your business? How do you leverage agility in in the projects that you are doing in delivering the what what your customers are asking you?
Lee Houghton
Yeah, it’s a great, great question for a number of reasons. Drag because I think the word projects defines it makes you think about a particular start and a particular stop. But agility should continue should continue beyond the project. And I think when we think about when we think about thinking, just Split, we’ll just use the word project. It’s, it’s defined. So how does it help us? I guess it’s about, it’s about removing the barriers at the start and stop. It’s about actually, the day that the project ends. And it’s, I guess, on the Gantt chart, is actually the day that you truly understand whether you’re a child, whether you truly understand whether you’ve got agility, whether people are really actually thinking of moving freely and easily towards that goal by themselves, without the external support coming in to help them or can they actually think and move freely and easily towards that goal by themselves. And for me, that is the focus of everything we do, it’s got to be sustainable. And the only way it’s sustainable is if you focus on the habits, we were talking about goalkeeping then about where you stand, how you position, what you think about where the attacker is, where the balls coming through, those are cues for a particular routine or for a particular habits to occur. And I think that’s what we’ve got to achieve, we’ve got to go down to a habitual level, within an organization, and, and work with all people to understand what the cue the routine and the reward is for that vessel, the habit loop a heavy cycle. And that’s how it helps because if it is truly going to be sustainable, then after the project ends, everybody will be thinking of moving freely. And he’s worked towards a global overcoming the stuff that’s getting in the way. And I think that’s what’s really important.
Gregorio Uglioni
And I think what what you’re saying, it’s really interesting, because there is one, really an well known trainer that is saying after the game is before the game. And if you in this project, if you can create this mindset and you set this habit, then also for the other projects that are initiatives, if you are in an agile way of speaking in the other initiatives, you can leverage what you learned. And you can continue to develop what you did, and what else and also the new stuff. I think this is really, really interesting.
Lee Houghton
I listened to I listened to I listened to a lot of books, and I listened to a book the other day for the second or third time. And I heard a quote at the end of it, it was it’s a book by Chip and Dan Heath called Switch. And it’s an amazing, amazing change management book. And he has a lot of practical advice in it. And at the end of the book, it said, there’s no single moment when a monkey learns to ride a skateboard. And, and it’s like when a child learns to walk, there is a single moment when they might take the first step. But they’ve not learned to why they’ve learned to walk with all of the little things that they’ve done, the positive reinforcement, the the encouragement that they’ve had, and then afterwards, they’re going to then take another step, and they’re going to do two steps, three, step four steps are going to get faster, more confident, more competent, you’re going to start running, the growing. And so there’s no single moment when somebody when a monkey learns to ride a skateboard, there’s no single moment when a team or a business or a department or a person becomes agile. It’s a continuum. It’s a continuum. And we just get better at doing what we’re doing. And that’s why I think the projects, some people, a lot of people are focused on just delivery in that moment and successes, getting to the end of it, turning everything green, and then we’re all alright. But if you actually have a continual continual focus, then it will be sustainable will be more successful and will be amazing for the people.
Gregorio Uglioni
And thinking goes about the first baby step the steps that the baby is doing, and try to learn. And this is only one initiative of the baby of the child. And at the same time he learns to eat he learns to speak and so on. And I think exactly what you’re saying this, try and fail, try and fail, try and fail. But continuing, continuously doing that with encouragement of the family of others, seeing how others are doing that is really extremely helps, growing and then really doing the stuff in the in the in the right manner.
Lee Houghton
Yeah, absolutely. We forget about that. When we as soon as we walk into work, though, we forget about the lessons that those are nearest and dearest to us. They were the ones that we help and support to develop every single day and be better human beings. That that will help them learn to walk and speak and all of those things, but when we when we walk through the door in the into our work environments, we seem to forget those lessons. And we become so focused on projects, define start, start business, all of that stuff rather than focusing on the whole and just people getting better every single day. And I think that’s what’s really important because A lot of people point fingers at leaders, but leaders are people as well. And, and they don’t necessarily have the same opportunities to learn and get better every single day as well. And I think it we need learning environments learning organizations, as opposed to those that just do independent projects that are for to solve a particular problem, we’re solving a bigger problem in reality, and we’re solving a bigger opportunity. And that’s continual learning, and making that those things acceptable. I am, I’ve just sparked a thought in my mind as well, that there’s four words, failure, challenge, conflict, and problems that when I say those words, people think that those are negative. People think that, that actually those are really, really bad. Well, they’re the most positive words that we should be encouraging, and an organization. So if I go back to when you asked me the question about agility, and about thinking and moving freely and easily, if we come up against a problem, if we come up against a challenge, if we come up against any conflict, and we come up against any of those things, while trying to achieve that, and then we need to just work through it, overcome it, raise our hand and flag it up and, and deal with it. And we tried to tend to, to kind of steer away from it. And those are, those are bad things, but they’re not they’re really positive. And those are what we need to explorers and make acceptable if we’re truly going to become an agile organizations.
Gregorio Uglioni
I’d say it’s incredible what you’re saying. And coming back backwards to the learning topic. There is a great comparison also to soccer to football, for our European friends. And their think about a team, the team trained all week to play 90 minutes, it means training and learning is they spend most of their time on training or learning for that event at an on Sunday or on Saturday. And therefore I think that’s that’s also extremely important. How much time do we really invest in companies learning, this new way of working? Learning what what needs to be done learning soft skills, what you’re saying, and how we are treating other people? That’s, that’s, that’s a big, big topic that that it’s extremely important.
Lee Houghton
Absolutely. Everybody learning, not just those that are doing the job, because leaders I’ll come back to are always now the finger of blame pointed at them. Or we just need new leaders we need really to get rid of him or her and bring in somebody new, but have we really allowed them to learn the leaders playground is the real world. So then, and yeah, so I think there’s this huge, huge opportunities for the for the right organizations to do this proper. And it just comes down to looking at on a habitual level, and on a thinking level, to really engage our people in what’s important.
Gregorio Uglioni
I think you are really touching the the most important or the core of agility. It’s not this tool or that tool or out to you the workshops, but it’s the way people have people are leading people behave, how people are thinking, and you shared a lot of advantages of this way of working, perhaps, to be to think also from from the other side. Thinking about shareholder expectation, thinking about quarterly result and so on. Often, people and companies and leaders are saying, yes, you started with this agility. But I want to know when this project goes live, because it’s relevant for our shareholder, it’s relevant for for our partner. And you cannot always say we are working on a minimum viable product, and we try to improve, improve, improve, I want to say when it’s live, when we can stop, and I can take your budget the way and doing something different. How do you cope with this with this type of mindset? And these, let’s say, these disadvantages that people are discussing about?
Lee Houghton
That’s another great question, Greg, because so we’ve got models, and we call it the best model. And not Well, we do like it. And we do think it’s a really good model because the best spells something. And traditional, so the T stands for target. So those are the things that you’re talking about around revenue, profit, shareholder value, all of those things might be production targets, and any kind of target business targets is that is the key part of it. And then what what creates those business targets is customer satisfaction. So the last parts of of the best model is satisfaction. So satisfaction drives, business targets, and that’s been proven time and time again. And then in the last five years, there’s been a big movement on employee engagement and he’s been recognized that employee engagement drives customer satisfaction, which drives business targets. And then and then what we’ve saw the last 10 minutes of that conversation has been around what it is to be part of it. And that’s leadership behaviors or behaviors in an organization. So it’s leadership behaviors drives, employee engagement, which drives customer satisfaction, which drive business targets, and different organizations, they start at different levels dependent upon their maturity and their belief, in this model that we’re sharing, the easiest place to start is at the top. And that’s where everybody’s, like, 1020 3040 years ago, everybody goes, we need to save money, or we need to improve the quality of this, because we track that we track the metrics, we track the measures of the all over the place, so people want that thing to be focused on. And then 15 years ago, when customer satisfaction or customer experience became more prominent, then then people more than more mature organizations went okay, we recognize that this is important, the targets, but we now recognize that the key factor is this thing, that customer satisfaction. So there was a big movement 10 to 15 years ago, in a shift towards customer experience and customer satisfaction for the more mature organizations that wanted to do it properly. And then five years ago, between five and 10 years ago, health wellbeing became more prominent in the market. And then people have made the links between employee engagement, customer satisfaction, and so on the more mature organizations can with an employee engagement strategy, when I say the more mature, those that have actually linked employee engagement, customer satisfaction, customer satisfaction to business targets, not those that are just paying lip service to it, they’re just think it’s, it’s an aside, it’s it’s a, it’s an incentive, it’s something to do separate to everything else. And I think now, there has been more movements in leadership behavior, or people or people behavior, and the psychology of people. So I think that’s the big movement that’s happening now. It’s about it’s about that. So to answer your question, with a lot of words is with what I’ve done so far, I think it depends on the organization. And and if the organization is drawing the lines between the t VS, the E and the B, then it’s far easier if they’re open to that. And they believe that that’s where it is, if a business is just trying to satisfy the revenue, or improve or reduce the costs, without and they’re just looking for individual projects to do so then that’s not sustainable. And they’re just, they’re just putting sticky plasters on the wrong knee. They’re just starting to graze as well, they’re not preventing themselves from cutting the cord in themselves. So I think the way to challenge it really is to is to open their eyes, open the minds, challenge them with that model. First and foremost, that’s what we do, we try to gauge where they are, we understand the links in the business to see whether whether the where they are both in terms of the metric ability to demonstrate competence, but also the the, I guess the their belief system of the leadership team and the language that they’re talking. And then with that knowledge, we then divide and create the right coaching program to help them. And like I said, Everybody’s different. Everybody has a different starting points. And it comes down to making people think, and our role, or get knowledge really is to is to get people to think and then it’s up to them, whether they choose to think as deeply as we would like them. So
Gregorio Uglioni
it’s extremely interesting. And I really liked this best model. And perhaps, for people approaching agility. Now you said they should go to this this model, but really, for applying some agility principles, where should people start?
Lee Houghton
With where they’re trying to get to? I think everything that I mean Steven Covey in the, in the seven habits of highly effective people said start with the end in mind. And, and that really is the only place to start. Where you want to get to, where are you now and where you’re going to get there that has that has to be in its simplest form. The the starting point, and And when I’m talking about where you want to get to I think it depends on the the team, the department, the business and at what level that you’re introducing this that I guess the agility, which departments are you’re introducing obviously organizational wide because This can truly be achieved if everybody is pointing and looking in the same direction. One of the first things that we do with an organization is around division. And their big challenge with visions is there’ll be pulled together by marketing people in the board. And they’ll have a single sentence that encompasses all of the director’s views of have a real high level, what is the word or where it is that we’re trying to get to. But that’s meaningless to the person who’s in the finance department, it’s meaningless to the person in the HR department, it’s meaningless to the levels in the operations departments are more meaningless. And what you have to do is translate that vision in a meaningful way to every layer of the organization. One thing you may have heard of the five why’s in terms of problem solving, which is brilliant as a as a question to us to interrogate a process to understand the root cause? What, what we like to ask the five why’s for the different reasons? So we try to understand why is this initiative important to the board? Why is it important to the senior leadership team? Why is it important to hear HR why is it important to operations? Why is it important to that team leader? Who is in a remote office? Why is it important to so I it’s important that we understand what it means to everybody, when that person when when I go into work tomorrow? Or how does my efforts contributes to achievements of that vision of that destination? So it’s, it’s not? I guess, it’s not the most specific answer I could have given. But truly, you have to start with where you’re trying to get to, collectively, then translate it in a meaningful way, and then work through the things to get them.
Gregorio Uglioni
It’s it’s super interesting, what you’re saying, because we can discuss about that not only specific to a project or to a company, but in general, because, let’s say perhaps, older generation were less attentive about what’s the vision, what’s the mission? What are the values of the company, they did their job, and then they went home, and they had all the satisfaction, perhaps at home. But now today’s younger generation, they are super attentive about why are we doing that? And what’s our vision? And what’s the purpose of the company, and they want to align the purpose of the company the target of a project together with their own targets, because then they can say, okay, it’s something that I really think it works, it’s important, it’s, I care about that personally. And therefore, I want to give my best to do that. And I think this is a big, big shift that some companies are already doing, order are still struggling to do that. But this will be will be the future exactly what you are saying, explaining why you are doing some stuff in the language of the different departments or of the different peoples and finding it at the end that common denominator to bring everybody forward.
Lee Houghton
Perfect. Yeah, perfect. So typically, when you see a company vision, it’s the T level of the best model, it’s about, we do this to satisfy the customer. We do this to to, to deliver whatever it is. And he said, the T level. And then our it’s maybe at the asset level, who might be of a customer if there’s a lot of customer centricity, isn’t it. So it might be the last level, what you’re talking about, though, is making it relevant that you level, the employee engagement level, but then, and it’s so it’s so important, really so important to just have this, this alignment so that me when I go into work tomorrow, I know how my contributions are going to help me get to the old stories and the NASA story about that. I think when I came in, which presents it was with Marvin nicks and went into NASA, and asked the cleaner what they were doing, and their response was helping put man on the moon. And there’s not enough of that there’s not enough alignment of each individual role and their contribution for helping the business get to where they want to get to, and, and they’ve got to resonate on a they’ve got to the ideally they’ve got to really resonate with Enya in their arts, and they’ve got really care about the mission. I was working with an organization not too long ago, and one of my challenges of them. I asked them, other people engaged because you can engage people in three ways. I reckon. You can engage the heads, the hands on the hearts, you engage in the hands, if it’s if it’s invaluable work. You can engage the heads by making them think More. And you can engage the hearts in getting them to truly care about the mission and the vision that you’re on. And far too many organizations only engage the hands. And the only engagement in work, not necessarily valuable work. So yes, I think there’s, we need to strive more to engage our people heads, and hearts are invaluable work to get towards the destination that we’re trying to get. So you’ve got you’ve got me on the soapbox, Greg,
Gregorio Uglioni
it’s incredible. What you’re saying, Now, it’s, I never thought about that. But what you’re saying it’s totally make make sense. And and if we worked on with our ads, then it’s, it’s something different than if we are only doing something because somebody told us to do that.
Lee Houghton
But when you think about a goalkeeper, the sorrow, the hands are fully engaged. They’re engaged physically, in that role, and that the heads are engaged, because they’re constantly observing the pitch and seeing where they’re going. But the amazing goalkeepers are the ones that love it. The ones that really feel that they love the team, and they love what that stands for. And they want to be really successful. So sports people that are successful sports people, heads, hands and hearts are engaged. But people in our organizations are not as engaged, which is why we’re not as successful as we could be.
Gregorio Uglioni
I think I will end over my cap to you and you can continue. Joking aside, and sorry, we are running out of time this game is coming to an end, but we’re still in the regular time. And the last question for the regular time, is I hope that you will come back sooner. But then the question is, in 10 years from now, we are back on the CX goalkeeper podcast, what we are discussing about
Lee Houghton
Oh, my God, not the same things we’re talking about. I mean, that would be that would be a massive, a massive thing. Fingers crossed. I wouldn’t be saying here. Oh, Greg, remember that 10 years ago, when I was talking about that best models that he had the E, S and T now he’s just a given. It’s all about the V and the behaviors. It’s about thinking, the thing that we’re going to be talking about. So as AI and as technology advances, that’s taking a lot of our, our thinking, we don’t need to think about as much as we, as we currently as we have needed to in the past? Well, it’s we will always need to think more. And hopefully, what we are talking about in 10 years time, is how amazing our people are with our thinking ability. And that comes from and to get to that we need leaders to be asking better questions. In fact, actually, I’m just going to share a little one thing. And so one challenge that I know another challenge, there’s a lot of challenges, isn’t that but is to win, it’s to get people to think, think more. And then we need to talk more. And we need to reduce the time between those conversations and actions taking place. So we need to reduce the time in organizations from our people thinking to action taking place. And in 10 years time, we are talking about the amazing thoughts and thinking that we as humans are doing to make today better than yesterday. That would be amazing. That would be amazing. We need to think more. Think more. That’s, and that’s why my definition started right at the start this conversation, which seemed like five minutes ago, but I felt it was a lot longer was my definition of agility is thinking and moving freely and easily towards a goal. And it starts with thinking that’s what we need to get better at. And that’s what I would love to be talking to you about in 10 years time.
Gregorio Uglioni
Thank you. And I hope that in 10 years time you are returned because you are following your son today to Europe and the world. Because he is one of the best goalkeeper.
Unknown Speaker
So wish, that was my answer to the question that you asked me. As always, that was the answer. Cheers Greg.
Gregorio Uglioni
No, that’s great. And now we are the game is finished. But I still have three questions for you in the extra time, the last three minutes of this podcast. The first one, is there a book that helped during your career or during your life that you would like to suggest to the audience?
Unknown Speaker
I’ve mentioned one already. And I’ll just I’ll say that one again. But then there’s another one as well. So I think Chip and Dan Heath books, which is an amazing one, for anybody that is leading or being part of change, I think it’s an absolute must read or listen, because it just has so many actionable or so much actionable insight for people to use. The second book, I think, touches on what we’re talking the essence of what we’re talking about here and that’s the Power of Habit by Charles Duhigg. He introduces the habit loop and the habit cycle, cue routine reward and the craving elements of all of that and thank you If we can master that, and we’re going to create more successful organization, we all talk about culture. And the definition of culture is the sum of all of the habits. So if you want to change the culture, we got to change the habits. And I think by reading The Power of Habit by Charles Duhigg, you’ll get some amazing insights into into into how to do that.
Gregorio Uglioni
Thank you very much. And what’s the best way to contact you?
Lee Houghton
LinkedIn is probably the easiest and best way I am on LinkedIn, or email is Lee at getknowledge.co.uk. That’s the business account co founded. And you know, we’re here to work to help champion people in the improvement equation.
Gregorio Uglioni
Lee, now it’s time to plug your podcast. Oh,
Lee Houghton
yeah, thanks very much. So I do have a podcast as well as completely. I’m so engrossed in your pod. Right? I completely forgot I had one. Yeah, I’ve got a podcast, business problem solved. It’s been going for about five years now. And it’s just a place where often it’s, it’s it pretty old alternates between me sharing some some thoughts and advice with with some shorter episodes, but also inviting, I’m speaking to some amazing guests. And hopefully, Greg, you will be one of those guests very soon.
Gregorio Uglioni
Ready to start the game together with you. But now let’s conclude this one. And the last question is, least golden nugget. It’s something that we discussed or something new that you would like to leave to the audience?
Lee Houghton
Yeah, I think that the thing that I’ve just I just said a few minutes ago, is around, I would challenge to become truly agile, is to reduce the time between. In fact, actually, there’s two metrics. metric. Number one, we need to increase the number of thoughts in our people. And metric number two, is reduce the time between thoughts conversation, and action is two metrics that we don’t measure in any organization. But if we did, and we were consciously trying as leaders to increase the number of thoughts by asking better questions, and reducing the time between thought, conversation and action, then we will be agile.
Gregorio Uglioni
I will never allow myself to commence the Golden Nugget because this was legal the nugget to conclude this outstanding podcast, but please, please, dear audience, I found this discussion really interesting. Therefore, pause this podcast go to lead podcast. Problem solved. So a business problem solved. And subscribe it follow only because it’s worth it. So it’s really great. Thank you very much, Lee for your time.
Lee Houghton
Now honestly, Greg, thank you so much. been an absolute pleasure to chat with us that much appreciated.
Gregorio Uglioni
Thank you, Lee. Please stay with me for the audience. It’s everything for today. It was really a great pleasure. As you know, feedback is a gift. You can contact me you can contact Lee. And if you find this podcast interesting, stop on Apple podcast and like it or leave us a pleaser review. Thank you very much and bye bye.
If you enjoyed this episode, please share the word of mouth. Subscribe it, share it until the next episode. Please don’t forget, we are not in a b2b or b2c business. You’re in a human to human environment. Thank you
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